Newbie Berserk Discussion Thread

Post by **Istvan** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 12:03 am

and remember casca may be a strong woman, but she already has shown she couldnt handle the trauma in the first place, and she already once made the decision to leave guts (for griffith no less;)) so its not like she'll follow him to the ends of the earth.

Two points. First, about choosing Griffith over Guts, I'll point out the relative situation each was in. Griffith needed someone to take care of him at that time. Even though she cared more for Guts, she felt obligated to help Griffith, she wasn't willing to abandon him when she thought he needed her that desperately to take care of him. Remember, before she knew that Griffith was crippled, she'd agreed to leave with Guts, essentially choosing Guts over Griffith. It was obligation that made her stay with Griffith, not loving him more. Second, the fact that the rape snapped her mind at the time doesn't mean that she won't be able to deal with it as a memory. No matter how powerful a memory is, it's never as intense and crushing as the actual event, and she's very strong. I think she can cope.

Also it doesnt really matter what she does, Guts wants to get rid of her anyway he cant fight apostles carrying her around.

I seem to recall him explicitly stating that he'd never leave her behind again, which would seem to contradict that. Where could he possibly leave her and know she'd be safe? There isn't any such place, not with Griffith in the real world now. As for not being able to fight with her around, he's fought a number of Apostles since she's with him, having her sane would have to make it easier. I don't see why he wouldn't be able to fight them just because she's around.

Post by **Libaax** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 12:11 am

Well maybe cause he knows there is a chance he gets killed fighting the enemy and if she is with him then so is she.

Plus he cant hardly protect her now fighting only simple monsters.

There must a be somewhere magical they cant sense her, maybe the place they are going who is filled with magic beings.

I just know that there is no way he would take her with him to fight Griffith even if she wanted to.

Post by **Deathbringer** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 2:27 am

ps: its just stupid to think SK was just fucking with guts. why would miura put it in there if it didnt mean anything? sure...Zodd was just fucking around with Guts when he told him Griffith was going to kill all his friends

Why are you comparing an apostle who knew that griffith was going to sacrifice his most precious thing according to a well known prophecy to demon kind to the Skull knight telling Guts of what may happen if he manage to wake Caska from retard mode?

Now that is stupid.

Post by **MrFelony** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 4:51 am

do you not understand foreshadowing? Miura wouldnt put that in there if he didnt intend it as a plot device. I can picture it now:

Miura: "oh ho ho, this is going to be so funny. I'm going to have SK fuck with guts by telling him casca may not want what he wants and then when casca is healed he'll jump outta the shadows and shout 'you got punked!'"

get real.

libaax: i agree that guts worries about protecting his companions when he is fighting in part because it hampers his fighting style. and as for logical outcome, the most likely one i see is that they heal her and guts tries to get casca to stay at elfhelm where it's 'safe'. I dont think Guts would want casca to come with, but he may put her in the charge of the group thats formed around him.

Post by **EnglishJim** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:52 am

It isn't just Caska, the whole damn merry band get in his way. If Guts could get them all to stay at Elfhelm to babysit Caska while he goes all Black Swordsman again, that'd be great.

MrFelony wrote:do you not understand foreshadowing? Miura wouldnt put that in there if he didnt intend it as a plot device.

I have to agree (for once). Skull Knight isn't the type of guy who just pops in for a chat. If he predicts that something will happen, know that something will happen. Though what he said to Guts about Caska wasn't so much a premonition, as a piece of advice. You know, like a "Don't walk into this blinded by your hopes" kinda thing.

P.S. Felony, you need to do an omake or ten.

Post by **Libaax** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 2:24 pm

English finaly someone that wants the same thing as me

The witch,Puck and Maybe Serpico i can see being a help.

Even though i dont Serpico has a chance against the Neo hawks that almost beat Guts to death.

Puck,The Witch are very useful. One brings him back from the armour,add some magic to his attack and one heals him.

Post by **MrFelony** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:08 pm

I like the direction that the manga has take, I just dont think it can last. just like the band of hawks, I think the "band of the blackswordsman" is going to end tragically. serpico would still be able to take on the average apostle i think, he's gotten pretty good at manipulating those elementals. he just couldnt take a beating.

and English, I would possibly be motivated to do a "you got punked" omake if i actually had the manga still

Post by **EnglishJim** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 4:09 pm

Shame about the omake, but oh well. New chapter in 3 weeks.

Yeah, I don't wish ill on the merry band, it's just great when Guts can cut loose and go crazy without anything holding him back.

Serpico wouldn't be able to take multiple hits from an apostle, but he's pretty good at not getting hit at all. Now that he can fly (near enough) and can attack enemies at a distance, he'd come in pretty handy. Puck and Schierke have their obvious talents, but the others, well, I doubt would last very long in a real battle.

Post by **Libaax** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 5:49 pm

Exactly the same thing with me, i dont want them to die or something but the lone wolf with nothing to lose was uber interesting.

I think even Miura knows it cant be travel around with a merry band for long in manga like Berserk.

Hopefully this band doesnt end as horribly bad as the hawks, bad for them

Post by **Gattsblackfalcon** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 6:12 pm

Like a behelit sacrifice for Gatts... anyone?

Post by **EnglishJim** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:14 pm

I can easily see something happening to Farnese and co. somewhere down the line. The situation was similar with the Hawks. First Guts joined them, found his place, then as we're growing more attached Miura slaps us in the face with the eclipse. I'm not saying Guts is going to sacrifice them himself, but something's gotta happen with the behelit he's carrying before it all ends.

Post by **God_Hand_Hater07** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 10:12 pm

i thought that the behelit he had already been used when he gave it to skull knight in the quilpoth (sp?) to make the crazy space time contunium sword?

Post by **MrFelony** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 2:15 am

I'm pretty sure that the behelit of his always seems to make its way back to him

. and as for the Guts eclipse...i've already brought that up a looong time ago (i think i actually made a thread about it in the Interstice...i wouldnt recomment that to anyone haha

). and actually the "band of the hawk" and the "band of the black swordsman" are similar because a central figure (Griffith and now Guts) attracted people to his cause. However, i would say that the biggest difference is that the people in Guts' band are each striving for their own dream just as much as they are striving to accomplish Guts'.

Post by **Gattsblackfalcon** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:53 am

LOL Felony , I can imagine what happened in that thread ( hence the Interstice ) .

Shit I went to Interstice and read that thread and now I know why that would never happen, first Gatts is branded and at the moment he summons the God-hand the apostles will kill him because he is branded and second Void already said that he can't use the behelit.

So, forget the shit I said .

Post by **Istvan** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 4:37 am

Even if he could use it, he wouldn't, anymore then he'd accept the Emperor's offer of employment. Guts just isn't the type to willingly become a non-human monster (you remember when he told the Emperor that he was human, and not to compare him to "you monsters"?).

Post by **Gattsblackfalcon** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 4:40 am

Yeah something like
Fuck you
Don't compared me with those faggots ass monsters ( I liked that part ).

Post by **MrFelony** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 5:26 am

well i thought of that before the emporer. However, it was mainly a pondering about how SK became how he was. Its a moot point though since any argument is founded on fantastical shit we dont really know anything about. and I dont think the god hand would be adverse to the addition of guts as an apostle, he intrigues them, and slann gots a proverbial boner for him

Post by **MadDogMike** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 5:38 am

Gattsblackfalcon wrote:Yeah something like
Fuck you
Don't compared me with those faggots ass monsters ( I liked that part ).

That part was so out of character that I hated it.

It's most likely the scanlators playing around with the translation because they thought it sounded cool(er). Do you think anybody really spoke like a gangster in medieval times?

Post by **Gattsblackfalcon** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 5:48 am

I thought it was out of place too but you had to admit that sounds cool.

Slan wanted to kill Gatts or just to rape him..... and then kill it, or the God-hand has future plans for Gatts ? damn there is a lot of things that could happen ( which is why I love this manga ) .

Post by **MrFelony** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 2:13 pm

I trust our team to translate it properly or as best they can.

Post by **EnglishJim** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:45 pm

I trust 'em too. But Felony, you started a thread in the interstice or did it get moved there? I'm gonna go search for it after this and take a look at your burn scars.

God_Hand_Hater07 wrote:i thought that the behelit he had already been used when he gave it to skull knight in the quilpoth (sp?) to make the crazy space time contunium sword?

I don't remember that. Actually, I went and skimmed the chapters where Skull Knight coughs up the Sword of Resonance and it shows the behelit "in pain" in Guts' pouch-thingy. So he still has it as far as know.

Gattsblackfalcon wrote:Void already said that he can't use the behelit.

I don't remember this either.

If someone could refer me to a chapter/post a pic, I'd appreciate that.

EDIT: Just finished reading the interstice thread. Well Felony, I can see what you mean with the Guts/Griffith spiral theory. A lot of it is speculation, but if you make the connections you can see the similarities.

As for Guts and the behelit, if Void says he can't, then he can't. Although here's a thought. Fate is having Guts carry the behilit (and I'm pretty sure he still has it) to a person who is destined to use it. Perhaps someone he's yet to meet will find the behelit in their possession through Guts.

Post by **Gattsblackfalcon** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 4:25 pm

EnglishJim , I am sure that was when Gatts where fighting with the Count , vol 3 I guess.Not so sure about that ( but at this moment I don't have vol 3, to check that.

Post by **EnglishJim** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 5:20 pm

Thanks. I just bought the first three volumes two weeks ago and I'm partway through the second, so I'll leave it 'till I get to it.

Post by **MrFelony** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 11:51 pm

Ya, I think he got it from the little wierd guy. and i'm glad some people out there agree with me

. also, the god-hand didnt think some one could survive the eclipse probably. the god hand are just pawns of Idea like everyone else. also, I'd like to see where void said it was impossible for him to use it, that is if anyone is willing to look it up

.

Also, Istvan, if Guts was forced back into his "black swordsman" mindset he was in in the beginning of the manga, I could see him sacrificing his party and viewing them as "ant beneath him." If he got enough arrogance maybe...long shot. However, I think he is probably going to do something less evil than that...probably whatever SK did to become immortal. and no I wont even say SK might be an apostle, Guts doesnt bleed when he's around him for one thing, though what a twist that would be (i already thought about it lol

).

you know those 4 elemental gods we had a discussion on mabe about a year ago? I keep wondering if there is some apostle version for them, and if SK is one...maybe created from sacrificing your life for others. this is way out there and I'm mainly going off of the whole "what the fuck purpose do they serve?" discussion we had earlier. It'd be interesting if we saw them play a greater role in the up coming volumes after elfhelm.

Post by **Gattsblackfalcon** » Sat Dec 23, 2006 12:23 am

The elemental gods? hmm yeah they have a purpose in the story , Miura just wouldn't introduced those things just to save that village, about SK being one of them.. hmm I don't know it doesn't sounds good to me ( SK past is hard to understand with the little information we had about him ).

And about if Void did said to Gatts that he couldn't use the behelit , I need to check that I am not 100% sure about it. But I think I had read that part ( or is just my imagination )