What are the aspects of a good Story

[Artezul]

The characteristics of a story is pretty general and known. Their's a hero, a villian, and a victim.

Bob likes Mandy.
Mandy likes Bob.

Billy likes Mandy.
Mandy doesn't like Billy.

Billy asks Mandy to be his.
Bob punches Billy.

Mandy falls in love with Bob.
Bob and Mandy live happily ever after.

This story has the essentials: Our Hero Billy, our victim Mandy, and our villian Bob.

Doesn't make sense does it? Most bad stories don't.

For example, Berserk. What part of the story drew you in? Was it the harsh upbringing of Gatts? How he evolved while he was in the Hawks. The engaging characters that he met along the way? The sense of loss after the Eclipse?

Basically I'm asking what do you think makes a good story? A moral/emotional rollercoaster? Betrayal or a plot twister? Give examples as you please.

Also, what makes a story bad? That is important for me as well.

This is more for personal enrichment, and it'll help me on my project.

[Skullkracker]

So what is your project?

Anyway I can't seem to find a fitting recipe for myself. It has to be a story that can carry my mind off the world I live in (which is damn hard nowadays with all the clichés), and characters that I find interesting in some way, or can find sth...hard to explain...damn dictionary failed me here...so I can find sth in common with them and myself. I like characters that have some kind of depth.
That's all I could come up with all of a sudden.

[Malvado]

Well since your asking why I like Berserk, I just be truthful. I like the maddening violence, do I care for the characters? No except I want witch girl to die so yeah i care about that. Do I give a damn about what happened to Guts? Well he was raped which gives him awesome points for kicking ass other then that no. Do I love the violence Like I said? Hell yeah. The thing is the story is good but I got tired of caring about it since it's been going on this long without them reaching any meaningful goal and I'm just coming back for the violence, which never gets old.

[MrFelony]

well im in it for the character developement. one of shakespeare's great qualities was his understanding of what it is to be human and his ability to portray that in his works. thats basically what miura has. The characters he has developed are astoundingly human, but he mixes that in with a great story telling and action so that it appeals to everyone. great action, great character developement, great story line and world, and the conflict that errupts so often. but i first got drawn in because of the action

[Skullkracker]

I like a good action too, but it doesn't have to mean gore. I like a good thrill, which is not so much visual, rather sth that we imagine...you know, the Hitchkock way.

[Necromancer]

Well since your asking why I like Berserk, I just be truthful. I like the maddening violence, do I care for the characters?

Same for me. But I also like the chaotic flow of uncontrolled emotions. The "Berserk".

[Skullkracker]

I don't really know what Artezul planned with this thread but I have a funny feeling he's into surprises.

[The_Paya]

Basically I'm asking what do you think makes a good story? A moral/emotional rollercoaster? Betrayal or a plot twister? Give examples as you please.

Read "The Count of Montecristo". This is a Novel, but I though of it as the right example that you need, basically because the "love trio", and "hero and villain" are most common in Novels, rather than any plain story.

It's more like how the main character develops strenghts or wisdom to overcome the problems on his path along the story than the things you pointed out I think.

Like from completely screwed, as the main character on this novel was, to a fake Count of something, to fullfill it's revenge. I think is that "sequence" what makes us "keep reading til the end" to see how the "screwed one" got to be the "winner" in the end.

[Femto]

I think this is a complicated question and that it is strongly influenced by personal opinions, but I'd say that one the most important aspects of a good story is the passion its characters bring into it, the raw emotion in it. Think Rurouni Kenshin, The Dark Knight Returns, Kingdom Come, The Nightmare Before Christmas and, obviously, Berserk. These are all favorites of mine and it's because all of the main characters in those series have an undying passion towards something (be it Jack towards getting out of the mundane and the routine or Guts in general) and I think that makes them more powerful characters. Berserk is one of my favorites series mainly because of that, because of how raw and pure its characters can be.

This is, of course, a single aspect of what I think is good storytelling and it mostly applies to serious/semi-serious works only. I like Berserk just as much as I like Watchmen, just as much as I like Dead Leaves, just as much as I like Tom & Jerry, so it's clearly not black and white. I'd say that, in general, a good story should have good storytelling (w00t), fore-shadowing, interesting characters, originality, good dialogue, mood/atmosphere, good pacing, a good ending and a good beginning among other things. Then there are things that applie to certain mediums more than others like a book being descriptive or a movie having a good flow, so its hard to not make this a Wyrm post without you being more specific.

[halfnhalf]

if you want ideas, just get hopped up on some drugs and start writng your ideas down. i was just kidding about that, but im pretty sure famous authors must have been on something to come up with their bizarre stories.

[Artezul]

I don't really know what Artezul planned with this thread but I have a funny feeling he's into surprises.

?

-------

So the list goes...

Malvado is into the carnage.

Necro digs the rollercoaster of emotions.

Skull and MrFelony for depth.

Paya for plot and suspense.

Femto for passion.

More or less I've had an idea stuck in my head for a few years. I guess I'm willing to bet on it, yet at the same time embarrased to explain it. This being the internet, you'll forgive me for not being more specific. I see a beginning, an end, but bits and pieces of the middle for the story. It feels right, but what I'm trying to do is not screw it up with something stupid.

The protagonist has to improve, but in such a way that the story doesn't become a series of tasks. (Aka Pokemon.) He has to interact, but not draw away from the plot. He is to be betrayed by the world, but survives it. Also trying not to make it a bunch of meaningless dialogue between fights. My worst problem is that I have two protagonists in mind.



Who is Wyrm?

Edit: Thanks half but... inspirition from being high...

[Libaax]

Anything that makes me wanna read it passionately and forget about the real world for a while is a good story for me.
I'm one of those that if there isn't anything in the story that i'm passionate about then i'm not gonna keep reading it.


For example in Berserk i like the die hard hero,the brutal world,the growth of the main characther.

In a manga like Hajime No Ippo its the drama,comedy,the realism, good characters,the amazing matches.

Also the most important to a good story is the characters if they aren't ones that makes you feel for them,then i wouldn't be interested.

[Artezul]

Hajime no ippo eh? I'll give that a look.

[Libaax]

Do that its one of the best mangas even if you dont like boxning.

[halfnhalf]

I think one of the most important theme in a story is internal struggle. You need it, or you would have know reason on why each person is doing what they are wanting to do most.


Hajime no Ippo is some good stuff, gets you into the story and makes you really want you to pick up boxing.

[evilester_me]

I liked Berserk because it was in an original setting that was realistic until the whole Godhand thing came along. But when the Godhand thing came along Berserk became almost like the ultimate betrayal/ revenge story, and I really like those in general.

I think all a story really needs to be good is a well paced plot and really likeable characters that the audience can root for. If you have a likeable character that is well developed its just fun reading about him or her and as long as the story still flows its an appealing story to most people. If you noticed in Berserk there are a lot of little parts that are some-what un needed in the manga that show us who Guts is. Its stuff like that that a lot of other animes and mangas don't have that make Berserk special. Just IMO

[martyr3810]

Necessary ingredients for a good story:

Likeable character
Mystery (about the enemy, the protagonist or the plot etc)
Change (the character(S) have to change as the story progresses)
Setting (Has to be realistic and fit with the story)

[dialdfordesi]

There is one thing in common with most classic stories. Their plots contain on some deeper level a truth about life that we can all relate to. All of the characters and their actions relate to real life, no matter how fictional and crazy they may seem. Take Don Quixote, for example. He is a rich guy who goes around living in a fantasy world, calling prostitutes fair ladies, attacking lavishly dressed priests who do him no harm, and he even charges a windmill. Now this seems on the surface as a crazy man's journey, but he is treating the prostitutes like actual people, not objects that just exist to be used. He attacks a lavishly dressed priest, when the Bible preaches humility. Also, the windmill being viewed as a giant by Don is not too far off from the truth. The windmills are tools of the business giants who will turn out profits.
This story has seemingly one-dimensional characters, a loose plot, and is off-the-wall. The only thing that saves it is that we can relate to it at a subconscious level. On another note, sorry if this sounds like rambling and senseless drivel.

[Artezul]

It's not pointless talk, it's more food for my thoughts. Thank you for posting. Give it a sense of verisimilitude. Damn. Someones gotta die then...

[Skullkracker]

and that death should be a painful loss...

anyway I said somewhere that I like Guts becouse he reaks all the rules if they cross their path...I love it if the hero doesn't let anything stand in his way...but still can't be called an evil raging maniac

[Devil_Dante]

The characters must be in search of vengeance. So the victory will taste twice as nice. And a original story, that's really important too nowadays.
The character gotta have some style too. I like sinister characters, with much hatred and anger. And NOT too much fantasy. --> Keep It Real

[Artezul]

Originality is a rare commodity these days. But I've been seeing too many spin-offs of other crap that I guess I don't have much choice but attempt it.

Soultaker. One episode just did it for me... don't watch it.

[Libaax]

I think one of the most important theme in a story is internal struggle. You need it, or you would have know reason on why each person is doing what they are wanting to do most.


Hajime no Ippo is some good stuff, gets you into the story and makes you really want you to pick up boxing.

Yeah i almost started boxing when i read but i couldnt cause of there wasnt a boxning club in the small town i lived at that time.

Not cause i love boxning cause it seemed like it works up the body to a good a shape.

[Skullkracker]

The characters must be in search of vengeance. So the victory will taste twice as nice. And a original story, that's really important too nowadays.
The character gotta have some style too. I like sinister characters, with much hatred and anger. And NOT too much fantasy. --> Keep It Real

It is not bad of the hero wants revenge as long as his character developes in the process and realizes that there are things and goals more important than that.
Maybe Guts is developing this way...

I like a character with style too...

[Libaax]

Maybe Guts is developing? The old Guts would slice Casca in two cause she slows him down and go after his vengence. He was so coldhearted in the start of the manga.

You cant get any stylish than Guts. I like his style much more than all the other manga characters.