Berserk: 286 - "All Aboard"

[LordMune]

What new smilies? We haven't had any new additions in, what, a year?

[Istvan]

She's totally going to rejoin griffith's neo-hawks. I'm calling it. If i'm wrong...well then I'm wrong. but if i'm right

You actually think she'll be willing to help fight against, and possibly kill, Guts?

[Sandman]

This chapter was pretty cool Farness's out of body experience was interesting, seems like a large leap to me but sometime that needs to happen I hope we get a look at Elfhelm sooner then later and get some good answers

[|||||||]

First…THANK YOU!

I hope there will be some development between casca and guts…

[dialdfordesi]

Caska will have to deal with the traumatic fact that Griffith, her savior, killed all his friends, but she'll also have to deal with Guts' inner demon. He did almost choke her out and left a nasty bite mark on her. Whatever happens will most likely be a crucial moment in the manga.

[Khelegond]

I've said it before, I think Skull Knight was speaking ("What she wants is not necessarily what YOU want") about her having to deal with the lost of trust in abolutely everything.

Griffith, the man that usually helped her, sacrificed everyone she knew (and care, since she took care of them for a year after Grififth was imprisioned) and raped her - in front of Gatts.
The Hawks - they're completely wiped from the face of the earth, and they're in "hell".
The world - Griffith is king, and demons are all the way around.

And last, but not least, Gatts - he almost raped her, almost choked her, and is probably bitter then ever.

In times like these, you ask yourself... WWJD? What Would Judeau Do? lol

[Aldarion]

EG is da bomb yo! Thanks alot for the scan

[Brainpiercing]

In times like these, you ask yourself... WWJD? What Would Judeau Do? lol

Judeau would die. Retrospectively.

But seriously, Miura Kentarou already said there would be a happy end. It won't be a happy end if Casca doesn't become a proper human again. So whatever the Skullknight said, Casca WILL want to wake up. Maybe she won't be happy at first, but a few rounds of serious Guts-love will put her back into the spirit of things.

[War Machine]

I think Skull Knight's warning is not about Caska not wanting to recover her sanity, but rather, after she recorvers it, she might not want to be with Guts anymore (or some other plot twist). Her recovery will happen though.

[Istvan]

I think Skull Knight's warning is not about Caska not wanting to recover her sanity, but rather, after she recorvers it, she might not want to be with Guts anymore (or some other plot twist). Her recovery will happen though.

Right, or she might not want to devote her life to revenge on Griffith, or the like. It seemed to me to be just a warning that she might not want what he wants, her desires might be different then his, in any number of ways.

[hbi2k]

Right, or she might not want to devote her life to revenge on Griffith, or the like.

That would be my guess. I wouldn't be surprised if she wouldn't rather just try and find some quiet corner of the world and try her best to live whatever passes for a normal life. I mean, after all the shit she's gone through, who could blame her?

[lon3vvolf]

That would be my guess. I wouldn't be surprised if she wouldn't rather just try and find some quiet corner of the world and try her best to live whatever passes for a normal life. I mean, after all the shit she's gone through, who could blame her?

That might be true... but to put another opinion out there many times when someone goes through something dramatic (such as rape, getting shot, or something else horrible) they often end up blocking it from their memories. With Caska being in a vegetative state, and no proof of her mind being intact, perhaps if she regains her sanity she won't remember the events of the eclipse?

That would be sort of awesome. Think of it, she only remembers as far back as rescuing Griffith and then nothing else. It would have to be more weight for Gutts to carry. Would he tell her what happened? I doubt it, and I'll risk getting flamed in saying he loves her too much to do that.

[Starnum]

I think Skull Knight's warning is not about Caska not wanting to recover her sanity, but rather, after she recorvers it, she might not want to be with Guts anymore (or some other plot twist). Her recovery will happen though.

Right, or she might not want to devote her life to revenge on Griffith, or the like. It seemed to me to be just a warning that she might not want what he wants, her desires might be different then his, in any number of ways.

Yeah, I agree. SK’s warning was not a prophecy, just common-sense, really. Once Casca is healed, she MIGHT not feel the same way he does. That doesn’t guarantee she’s going to go join the Neo-Hawks, or hate Gatts or anything. For all we know she might stay with Gatts and help him go after Griffith. At this point we just don’t know how she’s going to react to it all.

[hbi2k]

That might be true... but to put another opinion out there many times when someone goes through something dramatic (such as rape, getting shot, or something else horrible) they often end up blocking it from their memories. With Caska being in a vegetative state, and no proof of her mind being intact, perhaps if she regains her sanity she won't remember the events of the eclipse?

That would be sort of awesome. Think of it, she only remembers as far back as rescuing Griffith and then nothing else. It would have to be more weight for Gutts to carry. Would he tell her what happened? I doubt it, and I'll risk getting flamed in saying he loves her too much to do that.

Definitely a possibility, although I kind of hope not; selective amnesia is a little too convenient a plot device. It's been used a little too often as a crutch by poor writers for me to be excited about the prospect of seeing it in Berserk.

I'm with you that Guts might well not tell her if she didn't remember herself, especially given that he never seemed to be in any particular hurry to give Rickert any of the gory details of the Eclipse.

[Khelegond]

Right, or she might not want to devote her life to revenge on Griffith, or the like.

That would be my guess. I wouldn't be surprised if she wouldn't rather just try and find some quiet corner of the world and try her best to live whatever passes for a normal life. I mean, after all the shit she's gone through, who could blame her?

Problem with this is that her soul's destiny still is the abyss. She won't live her life, since every night there will be demons, and when she dies (killed or old age) she'll go the the abyss. I mean, that's what the brand is all about, right?

I think Gatts want revenge, of course, but I think the only way to remove the brand is by killing the one that branded him - like the souls that were freed after Gatts killed Wyld.

[hbi2k]

Problem with this is that her soul's destiny still is the abyss. She won't live her life, since every night there will be demons, and when she dies (killed or old age) she'll go the the abyss. I mean, that's what the brand is all about, right?

True enough, although there are still safe places here and there, like the cave at Godo's place. Long as she manages to get back to one before nightfall every day, I think she'd stand as good a chance at living a fairly happy life as anyone in Berserk's doom-and-gloom universe. (-:

Not that it'll actually HAPPEN, mind you, because that would make for a very boring end to her character arc and I'm sure Miura has something more interesting planned. But I wouldn't be surprised if she tries for it anyway.

[Chaos_Wanderer]

True enough, although there are still safe places here and there, like the cave at Godo's place. Long as she manages to get back to one before nightfall every day, I think she'd stand as good a chance at living a fairly happy life

They can't go back to the cave. It was destroyed during the fight between Guts and Zodd at the hill of swords. thats why they're looking for Elf Hell (to quote Ishedoro)

[hbi2k]

They can't go back to the cave. It was destroyed during the fight between Guts and Zodd at the hill of swords. thats why they're looking for Elf Hell (to quote Ishedoro)

Right, I was just pointing out that there ARE safe places out there-- the cave (now destroyed), Elfheim, and presumably others.

[Starnum]

Yeah, Elfhelm itself should be safe against just normal demons and apostles invading it. Now if Griffith were to try to invade, that would probably be very bad for the fairies.

[Istvan]

Yeah, Elfhelm itself should be safe against just normal demons and apostles invading it. Now if Griffith were to try to invade, that would probably be very bad for the fairies.

And I wouldn't be at all surprised if that was on the game plan. I don't think he'd do it before dealing with the Kushan Emperor (two front wars should be avoided, when possible) but I also don't think he plans to leave it alone forever, given the way he went after the old witch, because she was a threat. Elfheim ought to fall into the same catagory, I'd think.

[stonecold]

Can she even go to the Neo-hawks ,given that she is branded, isn't she fair game to all the apostles and demons in the Neo-hawks. And that also means she can see their true forms, being partly in the astral plane herself, freak her out unless she really thinks they are for the good???

[hbi2k]

Can she even go to the Neo-hawks ,given that she is branded, isn't she fair game to all the apostles and demons in the Neo-hawks. And that also means she can see their true forms, being partly in the astral plane herself, freak her out unless she really thinks they are for the good???

Griffith's control over the neo-Hawks seems tight enough that if he were to specifically forbid them from chowing down on her, she'd probably be safe from them (but not necessarily the Kushan Emperor or his minions, or any unaligned demons and spirits she might come across). Hard to think of a good reason for him to do that, though; back when she had her mind intact, she was a strong fighter by human standards, but compared to Grif's new demon hordes it's hard to see how she could be too useful to him even if she were willing to join up. (Which I can't believe she would be if she had her full memories intact; if there were a partial-amnesia situation like we discussed earlier, MAYBE.)

Guts' and Caska's survival does raise some interesting questions about the nature of the brand and the ritual involved in Grif's ascendance to the Godhand. It seems that the mere intention to sacrifice one's love one(s) is enough to make the magic work, whether or not the actual sacrifice is ultimately carried out. Not only that, but that intention seemingly only has to be present during the actual ritual, given that Griffith never goes out of his way to carry out the sacrifice of either Guts or Caska, even on those couple of occasions where they're close at hand and finishing the job would require literally no effort from him.

So I suppose it's possible that he might place her under his protection simply out of whatever goodness might be in his heart; aside from that (very significant) moment in the middle of the Eclipse itself, Griffith never seems to enjoy hurting people for its own sake. He might reason that, now that he's gotten what he wanted and Guts and Caska have been fortunate enough to wriggle out of their fate, there's no reason to allow them to be killed.
Not that that seems particularly likely, either, though; right now Griffith seems a little too wrapped up in his own crapulence as Supreme Demon / future king of Midland to bother with so much as a "hey guys, don't kill those two" over the little people who got him where he is today.

It's also interesting to speculate whether Griffith could remove the brands from the two of them if he so chose, and what effect specifically undoing his earlier decision to mark them as sacrifices might have upon his Godhand status. Don't know that that's too terribly likely at the moment, but I suppose it's within the realm of possibility that some further character development might lead him to regret his more excessive actions in pursuit of his dreams.

[thesyndrome]

i can't see ANY reason for caska to rejoin the neo-hawks...seriously none at all
A) the only reason she stayed before was for the MEMBERS of the hawk (jedeau, rickert, etc) and the hope of saving griffith; now that he is a demon king via sacrificing the old members, it seems stupid to align with him
B) he raped her...and tainted her child...then stole the body of said child...(she wouldnt know the last one though)
the only reason for her not to stay with guts is because of his almost-rape, but in all fairness i think she can understand how much of a strain was on him, and his loneliness
the skullknights warning was about her being scarred mentally by remembering what happened; and nothing to do with her going to griffith for whatever reason

i have to say, i do like the idea of the brand becoming useless (it wont be removed...its a scar, not just a mark) when the one who branded them dies, it sounds logical

[Istvan]

Guts' and Caska's survival does raise some interesting questions about the nature of the brand and the ritual involved in Grif's ascendance to the Godhand. It seems that the mere intention to sacrifice one's love one(s) is enough to make the magic work, whether or not the actual sacrifice is ultimately carried out. Not only that, but that intention seemingly only has to be present during the actual ritual, given that Griffith never goes out of his way to carry out the sacrifice of either Guts or Caska, even on those couple of occasions where they're close at hand and finishing the job would require literally no effort from him.

I don't actually think that the mere intention is enough, the actual sacrificing part is important too. If you look, during the eclipse we see several scenes of Griffith's body apparently being shaped/transformed by the spirits of the Hawks who are dying. My guess is just that he had so many sacrifices, it simply doesn't matter if a couple of them happen to survive. I note also, his transformation apparently completed itself before Guts and Caska died, lending credence to this theory.

So I suppose it's possible that he might place her under his protection simply out of whatever goodness might be in his heart; aside from that (very significant) moment in the middle of the Eclipse itself, Griffith never seems to enjoy hurting people for its own sake. He might reason that, now that he's gotten what he wanted and Guts and Caska have been fortunate enough to wriggle out of their fate, there's no reason to allow them to be killed.

I'm not actually sure that he can do that. If you look during the slug count arc, when the God's Hand appear, it seems clear that their magic is bound by certain rules. Just like the slug count couldn't change his wish (from "survive" to "kill the Black Swordsman") or sacrifice an enemy (i.e. Guts) I don't think that Griffith would be allowed to protect his "sacrifices". He doesn't have to kill them himself, or take any action to bring about their deaths, but I also don't think that he can use his power/position to forbid other Apostles (and, heck, lesser demons) from killing them. I could be wrong, but it just doesn't seem to me like protecting an individual you've sacrificed would be possible.

[Brainpiercing]

Griff is different, he's not just an apostle. He's a member of the god-hand. He can probably do pretty much as he likes.