Evil Genius

Nothing could have been proven in court. Project Paperclip removed many high level Nazi scientists and utilized the knowledge they'd built upon the lives of thousands for the US space, biological weapons, and chemical weapons programs.

Nothing could be proven in court because the United States made sure it never got to court.

As I said above, it's important that we recognize that this portion of US history happened. I think he should be left in the hall of fame. I also think there should be a notice affixed to whatever information is on display noting that this man was in collusion with the Nazi government and may have preformed unspeakable acts against religious and ethnic minorities. We should also note that he was brought into the United States and spared a war crimes trial as part of Project Paperclip.

Killfile wrote:Nothing could be proven in court because the United States made sure it never got to court.

And, to reiterate, the details of Project Paperclip remain classified. The United States continues to keep that information from the public.

vtwahoo and killfile,
are you guys reallife friends?
=)

i saw a documentary series called "space race" or "race for space" or something like that. it was by bbc i think.
anyways, it mentioned that either america smuggled these german nazi scientists(like von braun and his team) to the USA to work for them or let the soviets get a hold of them and their knowledge when germany was divided up after ww2.

Quest wrote:vtwahoo and killfile,
are you guys reallife friends?
=)

They are husband and wife, so yeah, I guess you can say they are real life friends. I think you asked that question before.

i dont think it was me.
thanks for the answer, eldo.
=)

I like how society pretends that being involved with the Nazi party was something as merely optional back then. Did they actually read how they came to power?

A lot of people joined the Nazi party to get ahead. The same as the communist party in russia. Does that mean they condoned their ideas? Possibly not. But does that mean they opposed the Nazis actively? Definitely not.

Well, I didn't live at the time, but being German myself I believe many people were quite content with having the Nazis around because being called Herrenmensch tickled their egos.

Remember the Nazis were elected into power. They didn't come with a revolution or a coup like the communists in Russia or China. I'll grant that during the chaos of the Weimar republic having a single strong man around sounded like a great idea, but I don't quite get why there was so little resistance in Germany. People fought losing battles before, why did so few people fight losing battles against the Nazis in their own country? Even the so famed 20th July coup attempt by some high-ranking officers of the Wehrmacht only happened after finding out that the Endsieg was a dream that would never come about.
In 1933 when the Nazis were elected most of Hitler's plans were available to all readers. He had already constructed his moral universe, and published it to the world. I wonder how many people actually read his book before electing him. Most people also knew that the Nazis had been terrorising the parliament with their brown-clothed thugs called the SA. Did that stop them? No.

Too many people still believed the perceived wrong, the "backstabbing" of the treaty of Versailles, could be undone with another war. Too many people resented the weak Weimar republic so much they didn't open their eyes to whom they had just elected.

Overall I don't buy it that in post-war Germany all the Nazis were suddenly gone.

Brainpiercing wrote:
...

Overall I don't buy it that in post-war Germany all the Nazis were suddenly gone.

interesting. thanks for the thoughts.

where did they go?
or turn into?

There was a reason why the Allies didn't have to fight a guerilla war, if we grant general amnesty then no one really needs to fight further.

Those still faithful to the Nazi party after the Allies steamrolled into Germany where regrouping in the hills of Germany, the blood shed there could have lasted longer if the remnant fought a guerilla war against the allies.

So yes, by saying "there are no more Nazi's in Germany", you gave the people a way out and cause for more bloodshed.

That is what I took away from Western Civ II, correct me if I'm wrong.

Quest wrote:

Brainpiercing wrote:
...

Overall I don't buy it that in post-war Germany all the Nazis were suddenly gone.

interesting. thanks for the thoughts.

where did they go?
or turn into?

They went to Chile, among other places. Kind of kidding, but not really

I thought it was Argentina. Along with Eichman and what not.

Argentina is the more well known, however Latin America is general was a new beginning for many trying to hide their past.

Well, in fact there WAS nearly a general amnesty. However, while the Nazi leaders were fanatics, the general populace in Germany was never very easily aroused into breaking rules. You have to understand that even without fines people here would probably stop at a red traffic light. If there is one characteristic of the German people in history, it's their belief in authority. YES there are exceptions, but Germans generally don't go for revolutions (nor for guerilla warfare). Even the Nazi elite didn't continue fighting, those that were not convicted and hanged went into hiding quietly, and never again raised their ugly heads.
So after smashing the Nazi state the Allies could easily re-employ a good amount of the German administration and legal aparatus, because those would do after the war what they were used to doing: follow the regulations. If the law said someone had to be put to death for being a communist (or for whatever reason), well, that had to be right. Once that changed, well, that had to be right as well. The whole atrocity of the Nazi state becomes apparent when you look at how formalised it all was. The people didn't need to be fanaticised because they were firmly embedded in sets of rules and regulations. Only a minority of people were incited to riot at the beginning of the holocaust, and even then, it was like following the rules. I very much doubt many Nazis would have taken to the hills if there had been more punishment. The Nazi system was not a hydra like modern guerrilla and terrorism, which is why it is really so sad in retrospect that noone managed to cut off it's head earlier.

However, all that does not mean that people didn't sympathise with the Nazis. I'm quite sure there was more sympathy than people like to admit. Do I have a basis for this? Well, to be quite honest, not a very good one. At present, it's mostly a feeling.

psi29a wrote:There was a reason why the Allies didn't have to right a guerilla war, if we grant general amnesty then no one really needs to fight further.

Those still faithful to the Nazi party after the Allies steamrolled into Germany where regrouping in the hills of Germany, the blood shed there could have lasted longer if the remnant fought a guerilla war against the allies.

So yes, by saying "there are no more Nazi's in Germany", you gave the people a way out and cause for more bloodshed.

That is what I took away from Western Civ II, correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm pretty sure this is where the US generals just left the Russians to take the casulaties in their big push to be world first.

Brainpiercing wrote: Remember the Nazis were elected into power.

That must mean they were an upstanding and legitimate organization. They of course were fairly elected and never employed any thuggish tactics or were involved in any political scandal. Politicians are straight as an arrow (even the Nazi ones), I hope no one tries to convince me otherwise.

Shisho wrote:

Brainpiercing wrote: Remember the Nazis were elected into power.

That must mean they were an upstanding and legitimate organization. They of course were fairly elected and never employed any thuggish tactics or were involved in any political scandal. Politicians are straight as an arrow (even the Nazi ones), I hope no one tries to convince me otherwise.

Ok, now I'm sure you voted for Bush.

I love Bush, he is the smartest most well spoken president we've ever had.

Shisho wrote:I love Bush, he is the smartest most well spoken president we've ever had.

Yes! Finally someone I can relate to in this board.

see, now when the government does its daily search of "bush" and "nazi" it will find this website and then the lawyers come. look what you've done .

Bomb Al qaida nuclear fucking weapon assassinate Bush Nazi antichrist


Umm... anything I else I should mention?

It seems the original topic has been discussed enough.

If it has been discussed enough, then time to create another thread. Remember, keep on topic.

I think psi is going to skull fuck this thread now.