Evil Genius

man, just the whole new band of the hawks thing always pisses me off so god damn much... what a bitch. i mean, on top of everything ...

::sigh::

I think its high time people stopped making excuses for Griffith sacrificing the hawks. We all know he would sacrifice them even if he never was tortured as soon the he got the chance. After the torture he had no other way of taking power and when he gets a chance that he didnt even dream about of course he did what he did. Its his way of doing things.


Every month some new member that is Griffith fan starts coming up with ideas to try to prove "Griffith would never do what he did if he had another chance"

Lets get over it and specially since there are so much better things to talk about.


Like Skullknight history with Void,Guts getting more and more berserk with the armour etc.

What if Guts isnt opposing fate at all? What if his fate is to oppose the way of the world and slave the God Hands?

One more then I will shut up....what if Guts never left? Would he have sacrificed them then? I think he wouldn't need too! ^_^

But yea, I'm liking this shierke controlling Guts/helping to comtrol Guts theory. Hell, I hope that when/if they get to Elfheim the elf king will be able to "power up" guts to be able to control it. Like by training him with it or something. That would rock. And I don't think they will be destroyed...that's too predictable. besides it wouldn't be any fun.

I think its high time people stopped making excuses for Griffith sacrificing the hawks. We all know he would sacrifice them even if he never was tortured as soon the he got the chance. After the torture he had no other way of taking power and when he gets a chance that he didnt even dream about of course he did what he did. Its his way of doing things.


Every month some new member that is Griffith fan starts coming up with ideas to try to prove "Griffith would never do what he did if he had another chance"

I wasn't trying to imply with my earlier comments that Griffith was in any way a nice person or anything. The reason I felt he would have wanted to do it on his own if possible wasn't a good/evil issue, it was I pride issue. My reasons had nothing to do with Griffith in any way being a good person (obviously he's not. Really cool, yes. Good, no).

On a completely seperate note, yeah it would be cool if Schierke could somehow teach Guts to control the armor. But I sort of wonder, if he was in control when he used it, would that mean that the afteraffects that SK mentioned would no longer apply? Or would he still suffer those, just not the "I might kill my friends" part. Just seemed to me to be something worth pondering.

I personally don't think a sacrifice can make sacrifices so we are all good.

As far as Griffith possibly not sacrificing the Hawks if he wasn't tortured (don't forget though, if he wasn't tortured he never would have ridden away with the wagon, fallen into the lake, attempted suicide, and found the Behelit once again) I think that whether or not he was tortured, as he is still bound by fate, it would have returned to his hands at the moment in which he needed it the most, and who knows when that might be?

And then with him sacrificing the Hawks in order to attain his dream, he even said it for himself; friends would never help him accomplish his dream, because they would have dreams of their own to aspire for, and would cut down anyone, even him, if they got in the way of their dream. He had sacrificed countless soldiers under his command before, and they were simply in the path for his dream and had to be cut down and piled up in order to reach it.

And the theory about Griffith starting a war with the members of God Hand...I highly doubt that. His dream is for his own kingdom, and as he reconquers every Kushan victory and his name gets spread in incredulous whispers across the country, there isn't a person who doesn't realize who he is. Now that the king is dead, and the pope is rushing to Griffith's side, where Charlotte, the king's only daughter is also currently residing, who would deny Griffith his dream? The decorated hero of Midland, with not only the pope's, but the daughter of the previous king helping him to stake his claim at the throne of the Kingdom which he saved from the Kushan's.

That's my opinion anyway.

He wouldn't have lost the Behelit in the first place had he not been captured and tortured.

I'm not seeing a battle between griffith and the god hand either, if only because it would seem like that story would have to centre on griffith more than guts. I can't fathom how Guts could play a central role in a battle of that sort...maybe if he gets uber-powered up due to the elf king..... (seems unlikely to me).

Regarding Schierke being trapped inside Guts, I don't think she's going to control him. She'll probably have to confront the wolf in Guts, though, and I am going to look forward to that.

First of all Malice he didnt lose his beheilt until after he was captured and tortured for a while.

Second.... Preview is up



I think that the armor is smiling, as if to say "there is no hope for you now!!"

Edit: Stupid internet connection cant even load an image correctly, I will try again later

Sandman wrote:First of all Malice he didnt lose his beheilt until after he was captured and tortured for a while.

I am not sure how what you said conflicts with what I wrote.

Regarding Schierke being trapped inside Guts, I don't think she's going to control him. She'll probably have to confront the wolf in Guts, though, and I am going to look forward to that.

Certainly she won't be able to control him. But if you notice she is in the eye of the armor. What I wonder is if she could use her power to be able to influence what he sees. Basically, I wonder if she could give him the ability to "see" friends again. The problem currently is that all the armor sees is foes, it doesn't understand friends as a concept. If Schierke can change that one thing, that would be a major improvement.

Personally I worry with Guts even having a behilt... as technically in order to hold onto one for any length of time you have to be destined to use it.

But as SK said to him he does operate somewhat outside of fate... kind of.

Fate drove him to leave the hawks and cause the downfall of the BoH... Fate drove him to return and get grifith to the eclipse site...

All that.

But then again he does act against it occasionally... slaying apostles seems to fit unless it was fate for them to die and for Guts to continue on doing what he does.... Ultimately we won't know until another major event happens.

Sandman wrote:First of all Malice he didnt lose his beheilt until after he was captured and tortured for a while.

Second.... Preview is up



I think that the armor is smiling, as if to say "there is no hope for you now!!"

Edit: Stupid internet connection cant even load an image correctly, I will try again later

Yeah, chapter 270's title is sword beast. I'm pretty sure they used that one before.

Personally, I don't think I would like it at all that Guts takes control of the armour. That would make him way too overpowered, heading over to the Bleach and Dragon Ball Z region. I very much prefer the armour to be an unstable element used as a last ditch effort for survival, a type of hail mary.

It looks like the armor gets more shape after every time guts transforms.
Perhaps the armor adapts to guts and not the other way around.

Devil_Dante wrote:It looks like the armor gets more shape after every time guts transforms.
Perhaps the armor adapts to guts and not the other way around.

Looks like it, it looks more animal in appearance at least.

Sorry Malice your post count must have made me read it wrong

I would like a little more control in the berserk Armor, I dont like it when Guts has to strugle

It looks like the armor gets more shape after every time guts transforms.
Perhaps the armor adapts to guts and not the other way around.

Either that, or maybe the increased shape is a sign that Gut's inner beast is getting more powerful, and becoming a more able to take control. Sort of like, every time you use the armor the ability to resist it is decreased.

As yet another alternative, Miura is settling what it's supposed to look like and it will settle down soon.

Personally I worry with Guts even having a behilt... as technically in order to hold onto one for any length of time you have to be destined to use it.

What was actually said was that the person it was destined for will always have it when the time is right. Thus it is impossible for anyone else to hold onto it when that time approaches. Since the owner of the Behelit that that Guts has is dead, this might not apply anymore. This theory is reinforced when we look at the large number of Behelits that SK has (in his stomach?) and see that he has apperantly been able to hold onto them for quite a while.

ok, putting everything aside...
Ive been rereading berserk, and i think that theres a high possibility that guts can summon the godhands if he wants. Theres after all no rules about a sacrifice offering a fresh sacrifice right?
What leads me to think about this, is at vol26 p073 where the girl godhand comes and tells guts: "otherwise, you want to make a sacrifice? like him?" and afterward, skullknight comes to the rescue. So i think that theres a possibility that in X years, guts might actually sacrifice his companions in order to be able to kill griffith, but hopefully this wont happen. Anyways, i know that theres also a possibility that she is toying with guts like u guys always say.

Lord Rae wrote:Personally I worry with Guts even having a behilt... as technically in order to hold onto one for any length of time you have to be destined to use it.

I think that if he is destined to use it, when it does activate, he'll just attack the God Hand, which may be why he's holding onto it in the first place.

Istvan wrote:

It looks like the armor gets more shape after every time guts transforms.
Perhaps the armor adapts to guts and not the other way around.

Either that, or maybe the increased shape is a sign that Gut's inner beast is getting more powerful, and becoming a more able to take control. Sort of like, every time you use the armor the ability to resist it is decreased.

As yet another alternative, Miura is settling what it's supposed to look like and it will settle down soon.

Personally I worry with Guts even having a behilt... as technically in order to hold onto one for any length of time you have to be destined to use it.

What was actually said was that the person it was destined for will always have it when the time is right. Thus it is impossible for anyone else to hold onto it when that time approaches. Since the owner of the Behelit that that Guts has is dead, this might not apply anymore. This theory is reinforced when we look at the large number of Behelits that SK has (in his stomach?) and see that he has apperantly been able to hold onto them for quite a while.

i think the beast shape of the armour is slowly refining to be more human-like. we can see that the head is more circular and skull-like now.


isnt skullknight's collection of behelits taken from all the apostles he defeated?
meaning that they are already 'used up'. he is just harnessing their energies or something.

Guts has never claimed to own that behlit. Puck on the other hand....

paulino wrote:ok, putting everything aside...
Ive been rereading berserk, and i think that theres a high possibility that guts can summon the godhands if he wants. Theres after all no rules about a sacrifice offering a fresh sacrifice right?
What leads me to think about this, is at vol26 p073 where the girl godhand comes and tells guts: "otherwise, you want to make a sacrifice? like him?" and afterward, skullknight comes to the rescue. So i think that theres a possibility that in X years, guts might actually sacrifice his companions in order to be able to kill griffith, but hopefully this wont happen. Anyways, i know that theres also a possibility that she is toying with guts like u guys always say.

FAQ wrote:Q: Can Guts use the behelit?

Whether or not it’s physically possible, has yet to be foreclosed, since it hasn’t happened. Yet, there is a chance that it’s possible, because there has been some teasing, involved with Slann. However, the answer is practically no. First of all, The Idea of Evil has already decreed that it wouldn’t happen. Gatts’ chosen role was to be a sacrifice. On top of that, Gatts himself has vowed to never use it to become an Apostle. There’s also the fact that by bearing the Brand of Sacrifice, that if he gets to close to the Maelstrom, he’ll be pulled into it. The only reason he even held on to the thing in the first place, was in hopes of being able to summon The God Hand, so that he might kill them.

I consider Slann's comment just teasing with Guts, since she knows how touchy Guts is with that issue. But basically, we have repelled rumours of Guts using the behelit from n00bs and other newbies in the past, and frankly, I was surprised to see it arise again despite the FAQ answering that question. We are not saying it is impossible, but the possibility of that happening is extremely low.