Where is Berserk heading now?

[Buzkashi]

Im just saying being on the brink of death for a year takes a toll on a guys train of thought. I just cant blame him for doing it. If he was in a normal state and did that then i would think of him a some horrible monster.

[Libaax]

He would have done the same thing even without have been almost tortured to death cause its what he wanted long before that.

If you wanna blame something on what he did,blame it on his how bad his life was when he was a kid.

[RedEyes]

I don't think that Griffith would have done the same thing before the torture (lets say before he slept with Charlotte). Simply because, as the leader of the Hawks he was doing extremely well.

Remember, he got rid of the queen so easily. One day he might became king by alternative means (when I say alternative, I mean sacrifices)

[Skullkracker]

Guts had a difficult childhood too, but he still wouldn't have done it. And I also think he wouldn't have done it before the torture. He wouldn't have done it as long as he had alternatives.

[Libaax]

It has nothing to do with the torture he did what he did cause he didn't have an easier way to his goal.

If he didn't get tortured and was forgiven for some strange reason,he would still do the same thing,cause it was a easier way to his goal.

[Skullkracker]

he had NO way!

[Libaax]

Yes he did if he wasn't a weak bastard. He could have used the hawks and use the people against the king. He is so good at manipulating people it wouldn't have been hard.

Also he could used Guts and the Hawk to make a coup.

[Iemander]

Yes he did if he wasn't a weak bastard. He could have used the hawks and use the people against the king. He is so good at manipulating people it wouldn't have been hard.

Also he could used Guts and the Hawk to make a coup.

Dude, his muscles were cutt off, including his tongue. Perhaps if he got the entire group trained in non verbal communication and had his body repaired. Yeah he could've become the old Griffith again.

I'm pretty sure Griffith would've denied the Godhand if Guts had stayed with the Hawks. Griffith says that Guts was the only one to have him forget his dream, thus he fell into a depression after Guts left. Thing is though, that if Guts would've stayed, Griffith would've "suffered" more and more in "decline" because of his friendship with Guts. Eventually forgetting his dream and practically doing everything for Guts (Griffith's words come to mind: "When did I fall into your control").

It's said numerous times, a few times by Caska as well. Griffith did things that weren't rational because of Guts.

But faith had a hand in the events, and faith is controlled by the Godhand. So in a way, yes this was bound to happen, the Guts - Griffith split as well.

[evilester_me]

But even with no muscles and crippled the princess still could have married him. Its iffy but could happen.

Also I view the manga as being divided into to two parts because the plot in the first part is strong and consistent enough to where you know where it is going but the last half of the manga is all really cool side stories about Guts. But then again, I think once we see the big picture we will read back and think "wow, I guess it really wasnt that random after all"

[Iemander]

But even with no muscles and crippled the princess still could have married him. Its iffy but could happen.

Also I view the manga as being divided into to two parts because the plot in the first part is strong and consistent enough to where you know where it is going but the last half of the manga is all really cool side stories about Guts. But then again, I think once we see the big picture we will read back and think "wow, I guess it really wasnt that random after all"

Yeah, I'm hoping for that as well.

[Brainpiercing]

Er, NOTHING was random. If you think the storyline stopped after the eclipse you're pretty damn wrong, the storyline went on seamlessly. Every chapter brought a new development for Guts (or his band), without those he wouldn't be where he is now. This is a story about Guts and his struggle, Griffith is just the antagonist, not the main character. If you don't get that you're dumb, simple as that.

As to Griffith sacrificing his friends without the torture? YES he would have done it, but only if it had become necessary. Every volunteer on his road was a sacrifice to him, which he would send to his death without hesitation if it furthered his road to a kingdom. He never needlessly sacrificed anyone, but his goal was the most important thing ever for him.

However, without Guts leaving him I suppose he wouldn't have sacrificed him so easily. But that really only counts for Guts.

[Libaax]

Finlay someone who doesn't think that Griffith suddenly changes his personalty cause of something like a torture.

I myself enjoy having the story focus on Guts Griffith isn't the main man and i hate when the "bad guy" gets the story more than main man specially since Guts is awesome.

[Skullkracker]

Finlay someone who doesn't think that Griffith suddenly changes his personalty cause of something like a torture.

Woah, suddenly is a strong word for a whole year.
But it didn't change his personality, it clouded his mind.

[Brainpiercing]

But it didn't change his personality, it clouded his mind.

I don't even think that (although I guess it's a possibility). IMHO it just robbed him of other options. It brought him to the point where the total sacrifice of everyone suddenly looked like a viable option to attain his goal. YES he could have started over from scratch, but in that situation the possible fulfillment in one step must have looked like a good idea.

Guts leaving him clouded his mind, definitely, but by the time the torture was over and he had been rescued his mind was made up. During the eclipse his thinking seemed clear enough. If he had really had doubts about the sacrifice he could have voiced them. In Vol. 1 or 2 the evil count doesn't sacrifice his daughter, and the eclipse is stopped. The Godhand don't force the sacrifice. But he CHOSE the sacrifice, knowingly and at that point in full power of his mental factulties. Yes, he may have become bitter over the year of torture, but he was saved by his friends, if his mind hadn't been made up he couldn't have sacrificed them so easily.

[Skullkracker]

I see your point, but I still say he went a bit nutty. That may be the reason for his visions and sudden changes of mood.
I'm sure his was fully aware of his situation, and found his dream come crumbling down as he was more and more disabled day by day. And he probably had the impression of being fully abandoned too. I tried to picture myself in the same position, and I surely would have lost hope in everything. I probably would have only wanted everything to finally end.

[Khelegond]

I tried to picture myself in the same position, and I surely would have lost hope in everything. I probably would have only wanted everything to finally end.

Yes, and he tried to suicide after all, in the piece of wood. He sacrificed everything to achieve his dream, so when the choice came, he just made a bigger sacrifice.

I think he would use the behelit when his dream crumble. Even if he wasn't tortured. It's just his dream, to him, is so much more than otters people lives. Simple as that.

Cheers,

Khelegond

[Necromancer]

Remember what Griffith said/though when Guts came near at the start of the eclipse "Don't come closer, stay away" or so.
I don't really know how to interpret this there are many possibilities.

[MrFelony]

Yes he did if he wasn't a weak bastard. He could have used the hawks and use the people against the king. He is so good at manipulating people it wouldn't have been hard.

Also he could used Guts and the Hawk to make a coup.

Dude, his muscles were cutt off, including his tongue. Perhaps if he got the entire group trained in non verbal communication and had his body repaired. Yeah he could've become the old Griffith again.

I'm pretty sure Griffith would've denied the Godhand if Guts had stayed with the Hawks. Griffith says that Guts was the only one to have him forget his dream, thus he fell into a depression after Guts left. Thing is though, that if Guts would've stayed, Griffith would've "suffered" more and more in "decline" because of his friendship with Guts. Eventually forgetting his dream and practically doing everything for Guts (Griffith's words come to mind: "When did I fall into your control").

It's said numerous times, a few times by Caska as well. Griffith did things that weren't rational because of Guts.

But faith had a hand in the events, and faith is controlled by the Godhand. So in a way, yes this was bound to happen, the Guts - Griffith split as well.

whiel rereading it i understood gus and griffith's relationship a little better. yes he became distracted from his dream, but thats because guts was the only one who could even come close to understanding him. the friendship had made griffith do irrational things, such as put his life on the line, to save guts. But Guts was integral for keeping griffith on his path. griffith could trust him most of all to carry out his plans. Guts also reminded Griffith of his dream and offered emotional support whenever he felt bad about commiting terrible acts. so even though their love distracted griffith from his dream and urged guts to follow his own, it didnt hinder griffith from reaching for the throne, if anything help him. the falling under his control part i think is more of his utter dependance on guts to take up the most dangerous of tasks. he talks with guts about that. it was his dependence on guts that controled him.

[Libaax]

Come on screw Griffith now and his reason to sacrifice his friends for things he could have gotten with thier help. He DID what he did and its over now and soon its over for him hehe

[MrFelony]

heh i didnt say he did it only because of the torture. but i agree that he did it because it was something he logically came too. though he commited suicide because i think he hated his life and the dependence he came to have on guts and could stand living the way he was any more. thats the most important thing. he didnt just sacrifice his friends, he tried to run away and then commited suicide. unless he "accidentally" killed himself...

[Skullkracker]

Remember what Griffith said/though when Guts came near at the start of the eclipse "Don't come closer, stay away" or so.
I don't really know how to interpret this there are many possibilities.

Hey, Necro, I kinda missed ya! ...wait ...no, not really...

back to your quote: it is a mystery, he probably didn't want them to come and see him all messed up, after an unsuccessful suicide, and all the craziness starting around him. He probably thought he was completely losing it, and didn't want his comrades to witness this.

Oooorr, he hated Guts for his conversation he overheard with Casca.

[Libaax]

Man this thread has become about trying to understand why Griffith did what he did.....

I say right now Berserk is heading toward some nice war,chaos,death and sweets things like that

[Skullkracker]

that's like saying that a train is heading toward a station

[Brainpiercing]

that's like saying that a train is heading toward a station

Quoted for emphasis

[|||||||]

It's pretty obvious that a big war is about to happen. to be correct it has already begun since the kushan occupation of midland. so let's just say the resistance ("empire" would have been too twisted ) is about to strike back...
if I got this right the kushans main force is about to land, on the other side the resistance led by griffith is ready to attack too. so there should be a clash soon. How guts party will proceed is hard to predict since their goal is to get to elfheim for healing casca, but there are many things that could delay this, like any involvement in battles. so lets just see what happens.