how racist is this shirt? + general racism discussion

[MrFelony]

So i wore this shirt in public for the first time (i've had it almost a year) and never really thought it was that offensive. its not overly blatantly racist imo, but i wore it to a class that I have with a friend of mine who is really into minority rights. i ran into him after class and he told me that my shirt was racist and he stopped himself from calling me out in class since we were friends. I was wondering what you guys thought (mainly Psi since he is actually part native american).

It also just so happened right after my friend saw a shirt in some store had 2 asian guys working in a dry cleaner with "Two Wongs make it white" on it (he made a big deal about that). and also we are in the middle of another big scandal since a fraternity and sorority had an exchange whose informal theme was "tacos and tequila" in which some girls went dressed as pregnant mexican girls among other things. he basically talked to me about how there is still a lot of oppression of minorities from whites by the perpetuation of stereotypes like this. I'd figured we have a nice long race debate or something (can move to politics section?)

also up for discussion: reverse racism. and bi-racial dating. whatever you want.

[Femto]

I didn't read your post but I don't see what the point is in wearing that unless you intentionally want to offend people.

Whether that shit is racist or not is a moot point.

You're wearing it because you want to piss somebody off.

Very shallow of you.

[swallow]

Yeah, how can you love Indian casinos when they jipped that poor guy who thought he won millions on the pokies and then found out it had a $10,000 limit?

[Starnum]

I'd say it's about as racist as Dave Chapelle or Carlos Mencia, lol. *shrugs*

[Bengal]

It's no more racist than a shirt showing a pciture of a mexican in a sombrero that says "I love tacos"

Overly sensetive people will take offense to it. There's no reason not to, the joke is in poor taste.

Anyone who's really honest with themselves will admit that the shirt raises a valid point, and THAT'S the part that will bother them.

Regardless, the shirt is designed to shock people. Don't be surprised when it does.

[Starnum]

*Nods* Tis the truth.

I mean, I thought it was funny, just as a joke. Of course, I try not to take shit like that too seriously. Of course there are people who will find that offensive though, so just keep that in mind.

[Sortep]

The problem with society today is almost all of you bastards out there take yourselves too seriously. Hence the reason we need a comedian as president. Too much truth has been said in jest, while fat rich white dudes have run shit into the ground. Long story short, lighten up bitches!

[MrFelony]

actually i think it'd be equivalent to a shirt that said i love mowing lawns with a mexican on a lawnmower...the problem is you might not (or at least in my case) realise or think something is racist until you come accross someone who does. i'm probably going to stop wearing it again just cause i've never actually thought of it like that...

I think the worst case of denial i've ever seen was when i was hanging out with a friend of mine from elementary school and we randomly started talking about illegal immigrants and shit and he actually said "I'm not racist or anything, i just think all the mexicans should go back accross the boarder" or something along those lines. my other friend and i gave eachother that "did he just really say that" look lol. the worst thing is when someone obviously has predjudices and denies them.

[Brainpiercing]

It's racism to exclude minorities from... well... everything.

So it's racist not to make jokes about them. That's my opinion.

(P.S. I'm sort of a minority myself. Where I live, I mean. I'm a half-brit in Germany. That makes me a target. MAN do I get to feel the heat sometimes...)

[halfnhalf]

reminds me of a poster i made in high school that had to do with indians and i made an advertisment out of it for indian gaming, 1800's style. yea i was brought the the principle's office for that one and the other one where i hinted that George Washington was a fag by saying he like big cigars.



I say no, wear the shirt all you want.

[Tempest]

also up for discussion: reverse racism.

Ah, ah ah! We don't call it that! We call it Affirmative Action! And if I wasn't a caucasiun, male, middle class suburbanite, I could tell you why it is wrong, but I am and I can't. Because that would be racist.




As for the shirt, yeah it could be considered kind of racist. At the risk of sounding too politically correct, if you think for a minute that something could be considered even the tiniest bit offensive, someone will jump all over you for it, and you should aviod it. Check out this article from Kotaku: Castle Crashers... HORRIFICALLY RACIST! Basically, this woman claims this beat-em-up game where and bunch of "White Knights" beat up on "the brown characters" is just bursting at the seams with racism. See also John Kerry's botched joke about the link between messing up your education and getting stuck in Iraq. Not racist, but that's an example of a poorly though out joke being offensive to people for the wrong/unthought of reason.

[Ayanami]

The shirt is racist, end of fucking story. If you do or do not take offense to it, is something totally different. That is fan-fucking-tastic if you see nothing wrong in the shirt, but a native american just might.

The shirt just has bad taste written all over it. Like native americans invented gambling, what a bunch of bull shit.

[Sortep]

No they didn't, but they did invent taking a bad economic situation and turning it around with legal loopholes in order to generate revenuet o otherwise money dead communiteis. Hence gambling in states where gambling is illegal.

[Libaax]

Very bad taste and very racist.



I dont see how you can compare comedy stuff like Chappelle to a thing like this.


Its like a racist going around with Nazism t-shirt and then going " I am only joking"......


There is a clear diffrence beteween things that is told as comedy and things that arent.

[Deathbringer]

I dont see how you can compare comedy stuff like Chappelle to a thing like this.

Because most of Chappelle´s comedy revolves around black people stereotypes?

[MrFelony]

i didnt really think of it as that racist til i thought of it throught the "I love lawn mowing with a picture of amexican on a lawn mower" analogy. and chapelle is pretty racist. from the way he depicts white people to the way he depicts black people. I'm pretty fucking sick and tired about not being able to say anything about racism towards white people because we "deserve it." that and it is still worse for many minorities. I'm just sick and tired of shit [/rant]

and the thing is libaax, many people i showed the shirt to up until my one friend thought the shirt was funny. And as far as racial jokes go, i cant think of any for the typical white male that are funny...anyone know any?

[Brainpiercing]

There are lots of shirts that make fun of whites, for instance some redneck shirts. Are those racist, too? Can you make fun of beer-drinking fat white people? Some people deserve being made fun of.

In fact, that gambling shirt even depicts the native americans as smart people who made it possible to gamble in places where it was forbidden. It's so ridiculous getting worked up over it. If an "indian" were wearing it it could be meant to piss off moralist bigots, why can't a white guy wear it? The only people that shirt really pisses off are people who don't like gambling.

Plus, there is no limit to where you can make comedy, and you don't have to put a bit WARNING: COMEDY on it. Making a joke or a snide remark falls under the freedom of speech, too. You can make bad jokes. People who don't get them are just too stupid to get them. Fuck them.

[MrFelony]

like Borat. I can't wait to see the reaction of people who don't realize that its just a joke.

[Damien]

I am also part native american err American Indian whatever u want to call it, and I am only slightly offended because I OWN more offensive band t-shirts. I tend to not take things 100% seriously, and YEA it is racist.

[EvilDmitri]

And as far as racial jokes go, i cant think of any for the typical white male that are funny...anyone know any?

"All you people sayin' black people taste like chicken?! Well white people taste like macaroni and CHEESE bitch!"

Forget which comedian said that, was good though .

[psi29a]

You have the shirt because it is offensive. You wear the shirt for the reaction, otherwise you wouldn't have bought it.

When your choice in clothing moves beyond survival/warm and into being something like fashion or some sort of statement... it is about reaction.

Racism is bullshit, so are the politics about/involving racism.

Equal rights, civil rights, and social equality are things to strive for but we won't ever see the end of racism, ever. By marginalizing the racists, you make them even MORE racist. The only thing you can do is wait for them to slip up, and put 'em in jail. Until they break the law, it is their first amendment right in the usa.

I don't ascribe to racism because I happen to know better thanks to University and other non-fiction works like "Blood, Germs, & Steel".

Affirmative action is also bullshit.

My 2cents of course, I won't even pretend that my way is the 'right' way.

[Brainpiercing]

The question is whether something that obviously builds on stereotypes to make them funny is actually fit to offend someone. Everybody sees the stereotype, only stupid people take them seriously. The real problem are the stupid people who think they have it all figured out. And you won't reach them by prohibiting a funny T-shirt.

People here keep telling me that I should be putting mint sauce on my meat. That's a stereotype, a cultural prejudice, rather, that was spread about Germany by the french/whatever comic writers Gosciny and Uderzo a long time ago, and people here don't get tired of mocking me with it. Oh yes, the brits DO sometimes put mint sauce on things. SOMETIMES. Does the fact that I'm not genetically different from your average German make those comments any different? But do I really take offense? Hell no. If people really want to believe stupid things about me, they're welcome. If they put that on their shirt, fine. I'll yawn, thank you. Maybe I'll even laugh. If I can, others can, too. If they can't, they should go out and get a life.

Humour is something that very often uses stereotypes. Without them, it wouldn't be so funny. Humour by nature is based on working on the ill fortune of other people. We laugh at misfortune, we think that's funny. The funniest jokes always involve some people being put down. As long as it doesn't break any laws doing so, that's fine. As long as it doesn't tell people to actually go out and harm somebody, that's fine.

Keep wearing that shirt, Felony. As long as you don't believe that it's actually carrying a message....

[Starnum]

Point in fact is, it's obviously a joke. Therefore, it's no better or worse than all that crap Chapelle talks about. I've heard the man stereotype whites into the ground, however, he makes just as many jokes about blacks as well. The man has admitted that he'll say anything, he don't care. If it'll make you laugh, he'll say it. Heh, and truth be told, I think he's one of the funniest mother fuckers alive. I laughed at that shirt, just like I laugh at the stereotypical jokes about how all role players are big ass nerds. I'm a role player, so I know it's not true. Well, I'm kind of a nerd, but nothing like the way they're depicted. They're all just jokes, you can't take the shit seriously. I have a good sense of humor, and I love to laugh. I can't stand racism though. Actual hate filled racism is despicable. However, until we can all stop taking shit so seriously, and learn to laugh at ourselves, we'll never make any progress. That's my 2 cents anyway.

[Bengal]

I laugh at the stereotypical jokes about how all role players are big ass nerds. I'm a role player, so I know it's not true. Well, I'm kind of a nerd, but nothing like the way they're depicted. .

If you look closely at the "White and Nerdy" video, you can see your evil twin swinging a sword around like he thinks he's a badass. Think about that.

And that shirt isn't OBVIOUSLY a joke. It's a joke, but it's not obvious enough. There are people who really believe that shit, and when they wear a shirt like that, it's not meant to be funny.

[Libaax]

Its a little sad when people see this shirt as a joke.


Its even more sad that people cant see the diffrence beteween jokes in a comedy program and a shirt like this. There is a reason why race jokes are on tv,movies instead out in the real world.



Thats the problem people are quick to see everything as a joke and not for what it really is.



I see Starnum talks about actual hate filled racism, for me there isnt a diffrence beteween this and so called hate filled racism. Racism is racism there arent some kind of levels to racism.


I wonder what Starnum would say if he had been the reciever of racism.

I have been one too many times to see things like this t-shirt as joke.